Posts Tagged ‘Junk Fees’

Curious search terms…

September 24th, 2009

What follows is a list of search terms that people typed into google with the result of eventually finding my website.  My assumption is these are questions that need answered.  So here’s my thoughts…

  • Accuracy of zillow estimates – I answered this here.  The short answer is, not very accurate, as Zillow’s own data demonstrate.
  • Are recording fees junk – Not really.  The deed of trust has to be recorded, the county clerk charges for this service, and so it’s a legitimate cost.  The next thought is, “should the lender pay it?”  The answer is, “It doesn’t matter.”  The lender never has any source of funds other than the consumer, and so if the lender pays then the consumer will be paying as well.  In the Denver region, recording fees are charged at $5.00 per page, plus a $1.00 surcharge.  So a 12 page document will cost, $61.00.
  • Average Credit Appraisal Fee – This search, or some form of it, comes up quite often.  There’s two questions here.  First, the average appraisal runs around $350.00.  The average credit report fee runs about $18.00 for a single person, or $32.00 for a couple.  See here for our current averages.
  • Closing cost amount to refinance my residence – Good question. First, are we talking gross or net?  In any transaction the gross amount runs from about $3,500 to $6,000, depending on loan amount.  Our typical costs are $4,000 regardless of loan amount.  That’s just our niche.  The net amount will be reflected in an increase to loan size, or the payment of costs via premium pricing (higher interest rate than what’s available).
  • Is the yield spread included in the apr – Yes.  Yield spread is paid based upon the rate above the par rate.  For example: if the par rate is 5%, and the loan is written at 5.25% then there is a premium that will be paid.  That premium is reflected in the APR that has the starting point of 5.25%.
  • refinance junk processing fee – The processing fee is junk.  It can be avoided.  Some company’s may use outside processing and so it’s a legitimate cost, but it should be absorbed by a reduction in yield spread or origination fee.  If it isn’t then it’s pure junk.
  • tax stamp junk fee – Nope.  Tax stamps are a tax paid to the state or local government in property transactions.  Now it may be junk as far as what the county charges, but the parties to the real estate transaction have no choice about it.  Just like paying sales tax on a latte.  It’s required, it could be absorbed either way, but absorption does not save consumers a dime.

Closing Costs – for scenario

September 8th, 2009

Each day I’ve been posting daily rates based upon a static scenario.  The idea is to give consumers a anchor point to judge where the market is and whether or not they’ve got a fair deal.

Rates are a commodity, but they can’t be wholly separated from price.  On my rate quotes I assume a closing cost figure of  $3,900.  That figures somewhat arbitrary, a SWAG if you will.

To ground my updates in reality I’m going to periodically post a break down of closing costs, and use the new figure for my daily updates.

The closing cost figure is based on a refinance scenario.  I use this rather than a purchase scenario, because the costs tend to be higher.  The reason they tend to be higher is that title fees on a purchase are bore by both the buyer and seller. i’ll include both scenarios here, but the daily posts will be for a refinance.

Final note, the scenario is a $250,000 loan, on a single family residence, with at least 20% equity, and a credit score above 740 (I’ve used 780 in my daily posts, but the breakpoint is 740).

Here’s the gross closing costs:

Fee Paid to Refinance Fees Purchase Fees
Origination fee D. White & Co 2,000.00 2,000.00
Credit Report Advantage Credit 32.00 32.00
Appraisal TBD 350.00 350.00
Investor Fees Amtrust Bank** 705.00 705.00
Flood Certificate First American Flood Data 11.00 11.00
Loan Closing Fee See note*** 225.00 250.00
RE Closing Fee See note - 125.00
Title Insurance See note 625.00 354.00
Courier Fee See note 40.00 25.00
Chain of Title See note 30.00
Edoc Fee See note 30.00
Release Processing Fee See note 25.00
Recording Fees See note 150.00 135.00
State Tax Stamp Colorado 31.25
4,138.00 4,103.25

Turns out my $3,900 was off by $238.  Future rate posts will reflect the gross closing figure of $4,138.00

** Amtrust is my favorite investor.  They have two junk fees that total $705.00.  That’s about par for the course.  The fees are named: Table Funding Fee and Admistrative Fee.  The names don’t mean anything, they’re just a source of revenue.  It’s par for the course in the mortgage industry

***The refinance is based upon title insurance provided by First Integrity Title.  I like them, they’re reasonably priced.  On purchases the buyer has little leverage to choose the title provider, which is selected by the seller’s real estate agent.  For the purchase I used title insurance information from American Heritage Title, because I had a recent deal with them and this is what they charged.  It’s kind of steep, but still cheaper than the refinance rates.

What is not included:

In real estate transactions there are charges called pre-paid finance charges.  These costs include interest, hazard insurance, taxes, and mortgage insurance.  These fees aren’t included here, for two reasons.

  • First, I don’t know what they might be.  Insurance and taxes are property specific as well as a function of the insurance agent the borrower has selected.  The interest due at close is function of the point during the month the closing is set.  I don’t know what any of these items will be and submit that they aren’t helpful because of, reason two.
  • Second, since the insurance and taxes are a function of the property they are independent of the mortgage and will not change from one mortgage provider to the next.  The interest may change based upon the rate, but the time of the month is an independent input.

Since these items are independent, they are often used to manipulate the estimate to make it look better.  Recent reforms have not addressed this issue, because these items have little effect on the Truth in Lending.

Also not considered but again independent as far as shopping are the fees charged on the payoff of a refinance loan. These fees may cost as much as $100, but they’d be charged in every case so they don’t enlighten when it comes to shopping.